HFSG press conference
Members of the Hillsborough Family Support Group held a press conference on Wednesday afternoon following the release of the Hillsborough Independent Panel's report. Here's what they had to say:
Opening speeches:
Margaret Aspinall: "We would like to start this press conference by thanking the panel for all its hard work on the behalf of everyone concerned; not only the victims but the survivors and the people of Merseyside. People kept asking me if we had trust in the Independent Panel and yes, we did. We said all along that we had trust and they have proven to us why we had the trust in them. We would like to thank Bishop James Jones, who has been a brilliant chair, and all of the Independent Panel. I would like to say, on record, on our behalf, thank you so much for what you have done. You have made our city proud. But most importantly, you have made the 96 rest in peace for the first time. Thank you very much."
Trevor Hicks: "If today says one thing to the world, it is that we are vindicated in our search for the truth. We feel for the first time in a long time that we are on the brink of a breakthrough. I think the breakthrough has been made, to be honest. Going through the panel's findings ended in a spontaneous standing ovation for them. I think that says what the majority of the families feel. I've said myself on many occasions that there were two Hillsborough disasters; one that happened on the day and one that happened afterwards. And I think if this report shows anything, it shows that the aftermath was not only just a disaster but it was a contrived, manipulated, vengeful and spiteful attempt to divert the blame. One of the things we have been surprised about today has been the unreserved apology from David Cameron. We were hoping for it and we were hoping for a report that would come out as it has done. The truth is out today and the justice starts tomorrow. We intend to follow every avenue - and that is everything from prosecution through to changing for an unlawful killing verdict and every other avenue. We are not looking for scapegoats, we are looking for accountability but those responsible should hang their heads in shame."
Here are the most pertinent questions and answers from the press conference that followed:
From the skim reading that you and your legal advisors have been able to make today, you talk about possible prosecutions, are you advised that this is a likelihood?
Michael Mansfield QC: "It's perfectly obvious from what has already been said in the House of Commons and in the report that criminal liability, for which there is no time limit, is very much on the cards. If David Cameron means what he said [this morning] and there is no reason to doubt in this, that justice has to follow truth, then they have a responsibility to ensure that, for example, the director for Public Prosecutions and the Attorney General should look very closely at the material that has been trawled over in the 450,000 documents, to assess the cover up and the perversion of the cause of justice.
What is your overriding feeling today?
Margaret Aspinall: "I can't explain it. I have a mix of emotions. I'm absolutely delighted for the fans that were there that day because I wanted to make sure they were completely exonerated along with the 96 who died, and that has happened. The journey for those fans is over. They did nothing wrong that day. They saved a lot of lives. We don't know how many lives they saved by what they did on that day. The police failed in their duty and did not use their common sense to do what they should have done. Our fans did that. The journey is over for those fans and they have got nothing to feel guilty about. They can be proud of themselves. I can't thank them enough."
You've suspected for many years some of the elements of this cover-up and some of the lengths to which the police and others went to smear those who died on that day, but were you surprised at just how far it went and the speed with which they put the plan into action?
Trevor Hicks: "We are surprised but not totally, because that is what we have been saying all this time. I'm staggered because we have known the 3.15pm cut-off was unjust but we know today that possibly as many as 41 people might have survived. The other thing that shocked us was that we have always felt the inquest was trying to re-write the Taylor Report and there is now evidence that shows that was absolutely true. To try and sum up today is extremely difficult. We should be feeling triumphant. We feel vindicated but it has been terribly, terribly difficult. We had three people faint as the info was given to us - that's how important it is to those families."
When the Prime Minister of the country stood up and was so unequivocal in his apology, how did you and other families feel after all these years when you watched that?
Margaret Aspinall: "I can honestly say that I was absolutely delighted to hear that. I think what the families have been put through for 23 years has been an absolute disgrace. When you think that they knew all this 23 years ago and put the families through so much heartache, pain and mud-slinging. We had to pay for the campaign ourselves; they had their legal costs paid out of the tax payer's money. They were the liars and we were the truthful and innocent ones and it's been proven today. The apology doesn't make us feel better because we are still and always will be the losers at Hillsborough. [The families and supporters] were the eyes, the ears and by God we were the voices and we used our voices to get to this stage and I'm so proud of all our families for that. Without them and the support we have had, we wouldn't be here today. So thank you."
It has been said that the families have been right all along and a lot of this information isn't particularly new. Lord Falconer you have held high office in government. Why has it taken 23 years for this to come out?
Lord Charles Falconer: "The reason it has taken so long to come out is because practically every single one of the public bodies involved withheld information and told lies. Secondly and separately, the justice system, at every stage, failed the families. It failed them in relation to the public inquiries that went on, it failed them in relation to the inquest and it failed them in the civil proceedings as well."
Trevor, you and others have always maintained this cover-up went right to the top. You've cited in the past the meeting between Margaret Thatcher and South Yorkshire Police the day after the disaster. The report seems to say it stopped at Chief Constable level. Are you convinced of that or are there still nagging doubts it went higher than that?
Trevor Hicks: "I'm not sure the report does say that. What we have said in the past, and will say again for others who won't remember, is that at the time there was big pressure for football fans to carry an identity card. There is comment that part of the mindset of the police on the day was controlling violence rather than crowd safety. I was a big Maggie Thatcher fan until Hillsborough. We don't think there is anything in the minutes, but then there probably wouldn't be in Cabinet minutes - they just have letterheads rather than a verbatim report. I would think there was a sweep of the handbag and [a thought of] 'the police mustn't be blamed, it will destroy law and order for all time'. We don't know whether we'll ever get to the bottom of that. My opinion is it did go to the top, even if she wasn't involved in the detailed planning."
Margaret Aspinall: "It definitely went to the top, I don't care what anyone says. I think it was from the very top to the bottom and no-one will ever change my mind on that at all, no matter what minutes haven't been found. You don't need minutes to say things behind closed doors."
Your message today to firstly the people who concocted those lies, and then continued to peddle them for the last 23 years?
Trevor Hicks: "At the very least resign and then stand up and apologise. Help us to get the message to the rest of the world that what has been shown to be the case, and that there was a dirty-tricks campaign that went on to deflect the blame."
How did the incompetence of the ambulance service when fans were laying on the pitch strike you?
Trevor Hicks: "That is one of the lessons we have learnt today. We knew nothing. We suspected it, but there is now evidence - and pretty strong evidence - that had the response been better and quicker, then certainly some people would have survived. It's impossible to put a number on it. We are staggered at the level of incompetence. In Bill Kirkup's presentation on the medical stuff to us, he said that almost every level the command and leadership had fallen down."
I have just been told by someone in the last few minutes that Kelvin MacKenzie has apologised and apparently said '"it has taken 23 years for me to realise that I should have written 'The Lies' and not 'The Truth'" in that notorious Sun front page headline. What would be your reaction to Kelvin MacKenzie's apology today?
Trevor Hicks: "Too little, too late is the immediate response. We will be pressurising the BBC. If they want us to do anything else with them ever again, he is off the screen or we won't ever deal with them. The man is low-life, basically. Clever low-life, but low-life."
You've spent such a large part of your lives trying to find and seek the truth - you've got that today. Michael Mansfield talked about this being the beginning of the end and seeking justice from tomorrow. How long will that process take, bearing in mind how long it has taken you to get to this stage?
Trevor Hicks: "As long as it takes."
Michael Mansfield QC: "Time is what you're asking about. On behalf of the Attorney General, it was said today he's going to get on with it immediately looking at the inquests. There can be no impediment to that. It's overwhelming in terms of the material that's available, I would expect him to be in a position to announce a decision within four to six weeks. It doesn't take longer than that given the report is in summary form. As far as other proceedings, the Director of Public Prosecutions looking at the documentation because a criminal prosecution is a very different matter and has to reach a certain standard of proof, that will take longer. It may take six months, it may take nine months. I think the families are, after 23 years, prepared to wait that time."
Lord Charles Falconer: "The proceedings will be dealt with much quicker if the public bodies involved acknowledge the wrongs they have committed. If they go on fighting, and if they go on denying and lying about their responsibilities, then it will take time. If, on the other hand, they acknowledge what this report and the underlying documents show, then the proceedings will be much, much quicker."
I apologise in advance for asking this, but for the last 23 years there has been so much focus on the people who did wrong at Hillsborough and not enough focus on the victims and the families, and what you've been through. Can you tells us what you felt today when you learnt so many of the 96 could have had actually survived given the proper care?
Margaret Aspinall: "I find it very difficult. When the families heard when that came out today, some of them passed out. It's a very painful thing to hear. I haven't really thought about it because if we do, our emotions will take over. We said to each other when we came down here, 'Could James [Aspinall] have been one of them? Could Sarah [Hicks] or Vicky [Hicks]?' We don't know who it is yet and we've got to face who they are. It's very difficult for us. What we are concentrating on now is the good thing we've had today, to go to the vigil at six o'clock and be with all the people of Merseyside, and afterwards think about that side and see our lawyers about that and the pathologist. That will be the time to deal with that and just keep today about this."
Trevor Hicks: "Just to add to that, we sit before you as officers of the group, but when we go home, we are the families of the bereaved. One of the good things that came out of today is we can get on with our grieving a bit better."
What specifically could the charges or criminal prosecutions be? Is there any specific offensive you think should be looked at?
Michael Mansfield QC: "There's an obvious one which the inquest would also need to look at if the Attorney General authorises that, but even if he doesn't we'll certainly go to court over it - unlawful killing in the sense of gross negligence. An aspect that hasn't been discussed this afternoon but was discussed in the House of Commons and is in the report - and it's not new - it's not just Hillsborough where this happened. If you look at the summary, you will see this was forecast from 1981 onwards. They knew this was a risk. There was no safety certificate and they breached the safety rules. That is the beginning of serious negligence and there's a causation relationship here which the director of Public Prosecutions will have to look at. It seems to me that is the biggest and most obvious thing, compounded by what happened on the day. There is more than police here - it's not just the police. Sheffield Wednesday need to answer some questions, the Sheffield authorities need to answer some questions on that score."
What do you think the people of Liverpool will get from today, and Liverpool Football Club?
Trevor Hicks: "I think they will feel deeply relieved at the very least, but I don't think there will be any great rejoicing - the time has gone on too long. But to use that word again, vindicated. After all the slurs, you'd almost have to spend 23 years apologising to make up for all the damage. It's not going to be put right overnight. I can't use the term rejoicing - it's a not a day for it because, at the end of the day, we're still losers. But at least the truth is out now and it can't be said [otherwise] because there is evidence that is absolutely not the case."
Have we just witnessed the biggest cover-up in British history?
Michael Mansfield QC: "The short answer to that is yes."